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ALM mmMidi to get more CV/Gates?

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  • ALM mmMidi to get more CV/Gates?

    Can I use midi out to the ALM mmMidi to get another 2 sets of CV/Gates?

    ALM mmMidi: https://busycircuits.com/alm023/
    Last edited by jruser; 08-03-2020, 04:09 PM.

  • #2
    I've used the Polyend Poly to add more outputs, works fine. I'd think the ALM would be just fine. MIDI is MIDI after all....

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    • #3
      Thanks. I'm kind of new and don't know that much.

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      • #4
        I use a Mutant Brain and a good old Doepfer MIDI-to-CV exactly for that (one for each MIDI out of the Vector). Both work without a problem.

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        • #5
          Good news is It works. A few gotchas. Glide information isn't passed to mmMidi (I think it's due to how glide is implemented in the Vector or mmMidi?) and there is a mismatch where C4 is between units. Also, if you transpose down, it will stop at a certain point I am assuming because there is a limit to how low the midi notes will be listened to (coupled with the C4 mismatch)

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          • #6
            Originally posted by adrianf View Post
            Good news is It works. A few gotchas. Glide information isn't passed to mmMidi (I think it's due to how glide is implemented in the Vector or mmMidi?) and there is a mismatch where C4 is between units. Also, if you transpose down, it will stop at a certain point I am assuming because there is a limit to how low the midi notes will be listened to (coupled with the C4 mismatch)
            adrianf Thanks for the info! I'm a little fuzzy about the mismatch part. Does it mean C4 on one of the mmMidi outputs has a different tone than the other mmMidi output at C4?

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            • #7
              one thing to possibly beware of is added latency of going MIDI -> CV, where the CV and gate events coming out of your MIDI/CV converter might come later (maybe ~3ms) than the ones Vector emits directly. it might not be noticeable if you keep your voices separated (1-2 voices from Vector itself, and the others from your MIDI/CV converter), but if you mixed the two (e.g., using your MIDI/CV converter to output CV from CC lanes that you apply to some timbral parameter of a voice whose pitch and gate are driven by the Vector's analog outputs) you might notice a timing mismatch.

              this is the reason I think it's very useful for any sequencer that speaks both MIDI and CV (like the Vector does) to have a global "analog delay" parameter, where you can dial in a precise millisecond-level delay of its CV and gate events so that they can temporally align with the inevitably delayed MIDI events it's also producing. I hope one day this is added to Vector, though it's not a super high priority if you follow the "voice-separation" strategy I describe above and correct the timing in your multitracked recordings later (if you notice an issue).
              Last edited by autopoiesis; 11-07-2020, 08:53 AM.

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              • #8
                @autopoiesis Thanks for the warning about the MIDI > CV latency.

                Do most users end up getting the expander?

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by autopoiesis View Post
                  one thing to possibly beware of is added latency of going MIDI -> CV, where the CV and gate events coming out of your MIDI/CV converter might come later (maybe ~3ms) than the ones Vector emits directly. it might not be noticeable if you keep your voices separated (1-2 voices from Vector itself, and the others from your MIDI/CV converter), but if you mixed the two (e.g., using your MIDI/CV converter to output CV from CC lanes that you apply to some timbral parameter of a voice whose pitch and gate are driven by the Vector's analog outputs) you might notice a timing mismatch.

                  this is the reason I think it's very useful for any sequencer that speaks both MIDI and CV (like the Vector does) to have a global "analog delay" parameter, where you can dial in a precise millisecond-level delay of its CV and gate events so that they can temporally align with the inevitably delayed MIDI events it's also producing. I hope one day this is added to Vector, though it's not a super high priority if you follow the "voice-separation" strategy I describe above and correct the timing in your multitracked recordings later (if you notice an issue).
                  I have used the jack expander, and also midi to cv via other devices connected to the vector, and never observed latency in any meaningful way whatsoever. The context is that I’m recording to my DAW which also functions as master clock. Although any conversion will add theoretical latency it would take a lot to be meaningful. Technically the above is correct but practically usually won’t present issues. Standard disclaimers apply etc.
                  Last edited by steve.turner; 11-07-2020, 06:02 PM.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by steve.turner View Post

                    I have used the jack expander, and also midi to cv via other devices connected to the vector, and never observed latency in any meaningful way whatsoever. The context is that I’m recording to my DAW which also functions as master clock. Although any conversion will add theoretical latency it would take a lot to be meaningful. Technically the above is correct but practically usually won’t present issues. Standard disclaimers apply etc.
                    That's great! It's not a guaranteed thing for all setups, though, as certain MIDI/CV converters have upwards of 8ms of added latency, and some MIDI gear has its own high latency.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by steve.turner View Post

                      I have used the jack expander, and also midi to cv via other devices connected to the vector, and never observed latency in any meaningful way whatsoever. The context is that I’m recording to my DAW which also functions as master clock. Although any conversion will add theoretical latency it would take a lot to be meaningful. Technically the above is correct but practically usually won’t present issues. Standard disclaimers apply etc.
                      It's quite east to demonstrate latency mismatches. Sync a drum machine to the vector, playing its own internally sequenced drum pattern, and then generate fill patterns with the vector using the vector's sequencer (triggering the individual drum sounds by midi) it's very unlikely the timing will be spot on. Not maybe something you would normally want to do but it'll highlight how things are behaving! Easy enough to correct offsets in post if you know where the latencies are and plan ahead (if you care - imo slight timing imperfections are one of the beauties of hardware

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                      • #12
                        Latency =/= timing imperfections though. You can correct for one, but not the other.

                        just sayin’....

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by adrianf View Post
                          Good news is It works. A few gotchas. Glide information isn't passed to mmMidi (I think it's due to how glide is implemented in the Vector or mmMidi?) and there is a mismatch where C4 is between units. Also, if you transpose down, it will stop at a certain point I am assuming because there is a limit to how low the midi notes will be listened to (coupled with the C4 mismatch)
                          Glide isn't passed to the hexinverter mutant brain too. One reason more for me to get the massive expander

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                          • #14
                            Thanks for the info on the mmMidi.

                            I was also wondering about the Mutable Instruments Yarns module. I'm guessing it would also work fine, but does anyone have any experience using it via the Vector?

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by jruser View Post
                              Thanks for the info on the mmMidi.

                              I was also wondering about the Mutable Instruments Yarns module. I'm guessing it would also work fine, but does anyone have any experience using it via the Vector?
                              I used an mbrane yarns cloneit worked fine but for drum parts you want to set the mbrane trigger length longer. I used 17.

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